Please DO NOT eliminate the Legacy Title creator in future updates.
Adobe tends to update with only the highly skilled pro in mind. But there are many advanced amateurs like me who DO NOT want to lose Legacy Title creator.
Yes, I use many bins for my legacy titles. And yes, I could explain why and my workflow to Adobe, but the fact is that these questions deviate from the real issue: remove legacy title support and people's projects will collapse forcing us to redo all our work using the graphics tools.
I personally know such a move would affect at least 35 projects of mine each with sevearal legacy titles, some quite complex in nature. Now, I'm only one person, there will be hundreds of us, if not thousands, using legacy titles. Imagine how many projects that amounts to!
Yes, I'm sure most of us are capable of converting all our legacy titles to the new graphics tools, but that's going to cost us an incredible amount of time in total, time which Adobe show they don't value with changes like deprecating lagacy titles; not to speak about all the various deprecated effects, effects which has had me (and I would say most others with deprecated effects) lost many hours researching alternative solutions, solution that sometimes have forced me to pay for third-party alternatives on top of my Creative Cloud subscription!
I, like many others in my position, chose in-built effects because they were considerd stable and part of the product. No one anticipated that these, nor the legacy titles, would ever be pulled on us users.
Adobe asks extorts us with their expensive and inflexible Creative Cloud subscription plans that milk us out of everything we've got, yet they don't value our time one iota. Adobe must stop abusing the position that they force on their their users. Adobe must turn user-centric, not Adone-centric. Users should drive the direction of products, not Adobe. After all, we are called users because we are the ones actually using the products.
P.S. Last week I unsubscribed from Creative Cloud because I could no longer afford it.
Daniel Hoover commented
@Alan That's a great point I forgot to make. The ability to import already created titles into the Project Panel via Media Browser is a huge deal. We have a template .prproj that we use as the starting point for all episodes and having them ready to go in our template is crucial. Without actual title objects in the Project Panel, this is impossible.
As has been said before you can change something in one place and have it ripple. Also saving common titles, slates or credits in your bins to drag down without recreating them or hunting for one to copy and paste in a different timeline (here's looking at you, "GFX SLATE" and audio channel mapping).
The fact is the most basic and ubiquitous concepts for dealing with media in Premiere are bins, the source monitor and editing. It is inconsistent with the software if their use is not supported with essential graphics.
Pierre Louis Beranek commented
To answer your questions:
1. On most projects, I normally only use 1 Bin to collect all of my titles. On complex projects with several individual videos, each on their own timeline, I might use one nested Bin per individual video (that said, it is extremely annoying that PP isn't smart enough to automatically collect all titles in a 'Titles' bin. I've done more than one FR for this in the past. Automatic Bin organization would be a very welcome feature (i.e. any newly created Sequences automatically appear in whichever Bin is set to gather 'Sequences', any Nested sequences go in a 'Nests' Bin, Titles go in 'Titles' Bin, etc). Search Bins are not an adequate substitute.)
2. Yes, I would be willing to show my workflow, but not to help Adobe understand how they can kill the legacy titler, but rather to point out just how much of an essential tool the legacy titler is for us editors, given how inept, limited and flat out bad the new Essential Graphics panel is.
It's very simple. Adobe removes the legacy titler. I stop using Premiere Pro. As surely will others.
Don't remove the legacy titler! Adobe's messed up enough things in the past. Please spend resources on squashing bugs rather than figuring out new ways to mess up our workflow! Thank you.
Daniel Hoover commented
Thanks for reaching out and posting this update. Legacy Titles (LTs) are a big part of our production workflow. We edit and deliver a weekly 30 minute TV show using a significant amount of b-roll and photos that need photo credits titled on the items.
Usually, we make only a few Legacy Title credits but they are used for dozens of items throughout hundreds of sequences (shows, clips, promos, social media videos, etc.) Using Legacy Titles are the only option because they allow us to make one change in the Project Panel item and it will change every instance of that title throughout all of the sequences. This is great for fixing things like typos or when producers change their minds. :)
Another reason we use the Legacy Titles is that we can see exactly where in the project they are used. This is possible by utilizing the Video/Audio Usage field in the Project Panel. We can perform an "audit" of sorts by jumping to various sequences and make sure the titles are placed on the correct footage/image items.
So in summary, yes we just the Legacy Titles in the project panel as a significant part of our workflow. I would be willing to demonstrate this workflow, as well.
Yes, please do NOT remove the legacy title. Its already annoying enough that I cant right click to access it and now I have to select "actions" "styles" ect every time I open it. Having titles is super useful when making quick mock ups to show clients and removing it would just be stupid.
Anyone campaigning to have this "amateur" feature removed is probably an old industry pro scared to lose their job because its so easy to create titles without AE.
You had your time. Its ours now. Kindly and quietly leave.
Mick Staines commented
Lagacy title creator is vastly better than the new title creator. Easy to use and customise
The Lagacy title is much more versatile than the new option and is perfect for pro users who need to eliminate titles and straps for international distribution. I would be lost without it.
Johann Jet de Jager commented
+ 1 for a vote not to remove Legacy title. For complex text requirements this would be a massive loss without it.
Oh, I forgot one of the most important features of the legacy titler: Multiple lines per text box.
Premiere's new text tool DOES have this, but the Essential Graphics that you create in After Effects and import into Premiere... Do NOT have multiple lines. which is honestly really annoying... deleting just one line in a big list of credits, for example, requires a bunch of copy/pasting across text box fields.
Also, dang, it really is convenient to be able to click on a (legacy) title style and have all the settings loaded instantly...
Thank you for taking the time to give us your feedback. I'm merging this to a related thread about not getting rid of the Legacy Titler (you know it's still there in the current Pr version (as of Pr 12.1.2 at least) right?). By merging things like this, we can keep all the votes and comments in one place where they can count the most.
Some User commented
The legacy titler was the best text tool I've seen in any editing software so far. Surely it wasn't very clean design-wise but now it's buried in the menus of Premiere and has even lost it's most important feature, the "import title" button.
I made a few presets for my text there and can't use them any more. The new text tool (where you add text as a video effect) is very clunky and not user friendly at all compared to the old one.
I constantly end up with text being out of bounds of the effect while still being in bounds of the video itself (see attachment).
Also, having the text as a video effect is just clunky itself. I really liked it when a text was an own element with its own editor. :/
Why didn't you just make the legacy titler look better instead of making texts harder to use?
Pierre Louis Beranek commented
I agree 100%. If Adobe ever pulls an 'Apple' move on us (removing the Legacy Titler, just like Apple removed the headphone jack), that'll be the last day I use PP!
I HATE the new Essential Graphics titler, and
I LOVE the legacy titler for so many reasons, many of which are listed here.
I imagine only new editors and/or those with very limited titling requirements like the new Essential Graphics titler. It seems to have less than 50% of the functionality of the original titler it wants to replace. What sense does that make???
@TaranVH: Because additional media is added the the project to keep up with new requirements and the new media has been captured with modern equipment and requires new CODEC support that older versions of Premiere Pro doesn't support.
One shouldn't have to do what you're suggesting if Adobe were user-centric and actually put us users first and did the hard work to ensure backwards compatibility. We, as users shouldn't have to do the work for Adobe. They should do the work for us by keeping backwards compatibility. We are, after all, the ones that pay for their software. To expect us to do extra work that costs us money on top of this is not right (it costs us users time and money when we perform workarounds).
@andreas For archival purposes, it might be best for you to NOT just have the exported video file. Instead, separate it into layers - one video export will be A-roll, another will be B-roll, and another will be graphics. You'd want minimal compression. Personally, I'd use 10-bit cineform with alpha for this (though I think it does tend to make gradients look banded.)
At the same time, export a multi-track audio or .ts file, with dialogue on its own track(s), sound effects on its own track, and music on its own track.
Obviously, this would require more labor, but it makes your content 100% future-proof. Now, no matter what NLE you are using, no matter what year or version, you will easily be able to re-cut an old episode. Even if cineform is no longer supported by any NLE in the future, you will surely be able to transcode it with a program like handbrake or something.
You can even build new episodes with this process in mind - always keeping all your music confined to specific audio tracks.
Personally, we even keep ALL of our original assets, like B-roll shots, uncompressed. So if we ever need to use a shot again, it's easy for me to go back to that project, open the B-roll folder, find the shot, and use it in another video. But I doubt you have 2 petabytes of storage like we do...
@andreas But you didn't need those codecs and plugins when those projects were originally created. So why would you need them now?
Every time you update an older project, I certainly hope you are still saving your older .prproj file. You never know what adobe might choose to remove.
The absolute best solution for you will be to keep an older copy of Premiere, for use with those older projects... which is why it's so important that Adobe should keep them available... which they have not done: https://forums.adobe.com/thread/2413891
So you better download the version(s) that you'll need, right NOW. And back it up somewhere.
No, it's not fine to replace it even if there is an alternative because not having the legacy titler will break a lot of projects, projects that, in my case, are constantly evolving, for example, (educational videos tend to do that) and hence constantly need to be revisited to update material. Sometimes I have to update a video that's several years old. I've already had a lot of issues with Adobe deprecating effects to find that these projects are broken. Deprecating and removing features will break backwards compatibility is not a good thing. I'm already spending way too much time finding alternative solutions to issues forced upon me by Adobe when I should be doing more productive and creative work and not patching issues brought upon us users by Adobe making decisions that don't serve the users but them. It's selfish and not very user-centric.
P.S. Suggesting one can just install an older version of Premiere Pro to work on older projects is not the answer for many reasons, e.g., a) depending on the age of the project, there may be drastic user interface changes between Premiere versions that interferes with workflow, b) the older version may not support the modern CODECs and/or plugins that may be needed to be used by the old project.
It's also worth noting that Essential Graphics turns the timeline red, and is very slow to load and render.
I'm currently rendering 4K on my top-of-the-line machine:
Intel Core i7-6950X CPU @ 3.00GHz 3.00GHz
64.0 GB RAM
Titan X (Generation 9)
And it's taking 3 seconds to render a single frame. https://i.imgur.com/JGajDZT.png
Had I used the legacy titler instead, this would be done rendering by now.
Visual Feast commented
I know this is already under review, but just wanted to put some things out here.
Once the new tools have *all* the functionality & quality of the legacy one, then it might be fine. But right now, many things are missing in the new one.
- Can't nudge text or graphics around pixel-by-pixel with the arrow keys and shift+arrow keys like you can in Legacy (and these keys are assignable in the Keyboard Shortcuts for Legacy... by it having a separate window, which is great in itself, it allows separate keyboard shortcuts that would conflict with the new tool being in the program monitor.)
- the new titles are not as sharp as Legacy and the anti-aliasing is not as good. https://prnt.sc/kfwqhm
- Legacy tool creates a reference in the project bin and alt+dragging on timeline copies and creates a new copy in the project bin. Perfect for diverse workflows.
- Path Type Tool? Rounded rectangles? Holding down shift to draw perfect horiz/vert/45 degree lines? Line cap type? Join type? Miter Limit? Distortion?
- Fill types (4-color Gradient, Bevel, Eliminate, Ghost)? Sheen? Texture?
- Proper fills and shadows on open Pen shapes? (Legacy does it correct; new tool closes the shadow on open Beziers: https://prntscr.com/kfwp4n)
- Inner and outer strokes?
- Create the perfect style (drop-shadow, fill, o̶u̶t̶e̶r̶ ̶s̶t̶r̶o̶k̶e̶ (oops not possible in new tool)) on a bezier shape in new tool and want to put it on some text? Nope. In Legacy, just save it as a style and apply to anything.
Speaking of Beziers... legacy allows you to quickly convert lines from open bezier to closed or filled. New tool-- once closed, cannot be made an open bezier again. Legacy-- double-clicking a bezier goes into edit mode. New tool you have to manually switch to the pen first.
Last, legacy works well with older and shared projects. New tool... often get errors and incompatibilities. http://prntscr.com/kfwtw5
We need this feature to stay! I like having the separate window and it is really quick to use. Really great feature, would HATE to see it go.